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Forum -> Parenting our children -> School age children
Need help with discipline



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amother


 

Post Thu, Dec 18 2014, 8:21 pm
When my oldest child was little I went to parenting classes which greatly impressed me bc it was all about natural consequences and no bribery, no threats, no punishment and to think about the person u want ur child to b as an adult not just a little robot but while I still love this as theory in reality its just not enough of a guideline on how to discipline.

bh now 6yrs down the line and a few more kids plus a new baby my kids just don't listen at all when I ask them to do stuff, and bedtime is a disaster, we r in a small apt which aggravates the situation.

we set up certain chores eg.child 1 clears and cleans breakfast, child 2 does supper but it won't get done if I dont remind and then they moan about it an walk away. Its the same job every day.

Or getting in the shower and these r time sensitive activities as other ppl need to use the bath or the cleaning lady is coming so dishes need to b in the sink so I cant leave til they get round to it.

they r extremely careless with their own posessions and touching my stuff too even tho from day1 we have had a rule dont touch stuff that does not belong to u without asking. Theres just no respect.

Things r basically hefker at the moment and it cant continue this way. Is there a method / book u can recommend that can help guide us in disciplining our kids in a loving but effective way?
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mummiedearest




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Dec 18 2014, 9:19 pm
1) you leave your toys on the floor, it is mine. you will not get it back until I feel you deserve it.

2) you have until the count of five to get in the shower. if you do not do so, I will place you in the tub with whatever clothes you have on.

3) children who do not do their designated chores do not get special privileges.

4) pajamas are not necessities. if you are not ready for bed by 7:30 (for example), I will place you in your bed in whatever state of dress/undress I catch you in.

5) if you touch parents' belongings without permission, you will be fined. an alternate option: store your stuff out of their reach.

6) intentional chutzpah warrants a time out.

I'm sure this all sounds quite harsh to you, but sometimes natural consequences are as follows: you misbehave, your parents punish you. and you need to be consistent, or they will trample all over you.
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granolamom




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Dec 18 2014, 10:02 pm
mummiedearest wrote:
1) you leave your toys on the floor, it is mine. you will not get it back until I feel you deserve it.

2) you have until the count of five to get in the shower. if you do not do so, I will place you in the tub with whatever clothes you have on.

3) children who do not do their designated chores do not get special privileges.

4) pajamas are not necessities. if you are not ready for bed by 7:30 (for example), I will place you in your bed in whatever state of dress/undress I catch you in.

5) if you touch parents' belongings without permission, you will be fined. an alternate option: store your stuff out of their reach.

6) intentional chutzpah warrants a time out.

I'm sure this all sounds quite harsh to you, but sometimes natural consequences are as follows: you misbehave, your parents punish you. and you need to be consistent, or they will trample all over you.


these are not really natural consequences. there is nothing in the natural order of things that would cause a shower-resistant child to find himself in the tub fully clothed. natural consequence would be you dont shower at your alotted time, you lose the opportunity to shower. your hair will be greasy and you will smell and possibly offend people and be made fun of in school.
you misbehave and your parent is angry is possibly a natural consequence. parents choice to then respond punitively may be relevant and reasonable, but its not a natural consequence.

there are so many types of kids and parents, the most important thing is to find a philosophy that resonates with you. If mummiedearest can consistently carry out all the above, then it may very well work in her home. If OP is not able to physically place a child into bed or the tub, then it isnt going to work. do not make threats that you cannot carry out. I know there is no way I could physically overpower my kids that way, and ime, time outs do not lessen intentional chutzpah. I took the Dina Friedman course (chanoch lnaar) and found it very helpful for situations like OP described.

one of the topics she addressed was reclaiming your authority. not in a punitive way, but give directives and stick by your demands all the way through the tantrums just so that they see your word means something. same with saying no, dont change your mind in the beginning. once you say no its no. of course once you feel more in your power you can start to allow your child to rationally present his reasons for what ever the thing was that you initially said no to and sometimes its ok to say you know I didnt consider that angle, we can try it. but not from a place where you feel bullied into it.

also, OP, something to think about..you say you have a new baby. that means that things will be hefker for a bit, the kids lose their footing with a new addition. that's normal and to be expected. this might not be the time for a big change up in your discipline method or style. they are possibly very sensitive to change and honestly, are you feeling emotionally strong? because you need to be to set in place new systems.
and how old are your kids? if they are very young, maybe they legitimately need more hands on support in carrying out their chores.
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FranticFrummie




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Dec 18 2014, 10:05 pm
I was just about to post the same thing! My 11yo is having an epic, 3yo level tantrum as we speak.

*sigh*
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amother


 

Post Fri, Dec 19 2014, 1:09 am
OP here: my oldest is nearly 10 and for sure stronger than me! I tried to march him to his room the other day after hurting his sibling and could not budge him.
Allowing him to b greasy/smelly does not bother him at all, he happily sleeps in his clothes so in this case a natural consequence would not work.
for sure the new baby exacerbated the problem but none of this behaviour is new.
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the world's best mom




 
 
    
 

Post Fri, Dec 19 2014, 8:47 am
Children are like that. Sigh.

I have never heard of children who come running excitedly the moment their mother calls them to clean up from supper. They probably hate it, so they delay as much as possible. Is it possible that it's too hard for them? Or maybe if someone helps them a bit it will seem more doable for them?

In my house, nobody leaves the table until taking their own place setting and putting it in the sink/garbage. If they forget, I call them right back. If they don't listen, I just keep repeating it like a broken record. That usually gets them there pretty quickly. I clear off the rest, but maybe that is a reasonable thing to ask kids to do. I don't know. I guess every family is different. For me it wouldn't be worth the fight.

I find that rewards are extremely helpful in disciplining. You can start a system where each kid who listens the first time when told to take a shower will get a sticker on the shower chart. After ten stickers you get a prize or something like that. The trick is to be specific- tackle one misbehavior at a time. Just to give stickers for listening nicely throughout the day is too general and won't be as effective.
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saw50st8




 
 
    
 

Post Fri, Dec 19 2014, 8:55 am
I don't have kids that age yet. What we do is that kids need to do the things they don't want to do before the thing they are more likely want to do.

For us, it means kids need to be fully dressed and ready before eating breakfast. (we were having trouble with them getting ready for school)

I would have your son shower before dinner for example.

Kids who don't bring their dishes in will miss the cleaning help washing them and must wash their own plate before eating the next meal.

Don't let your children control the situation.

Also, are they involved in any after school/weekend type activities? I would suspend any activity if they can't follow the basic rules because they need extra time to do them. Don't label it as punitive, label it as the time for them to do chores since they didn't do it at the appropriate time.
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