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Not invited to wedding - should I send MT wishes?
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PostPosted: Sun, Jul 22 2012, 9:53 am    Post subject: Not invited to wedding - should I send MT wishes?
 
My first cousin is getting married in a few weeks. She is making a small wedding and didn't invite any family except her and her parents' siblings, AFAIK. A lot of the first cousins are hurt by this, especially as in our circles it just isn't done, not to invite close family to your wedding. However, it's her wedding and if she's not interested in sharing the simcha with the family, that's her prerogative.

Now, I live pretty far OOT and I wouldn't have been able to come to the wedding anyhow, so I don't really care that I wasn't invited. I would email her mazel tov wishes, but I'm wondering if she wouldn't take this as a snarky comment on not inviting me. FTR, I emailed her mazel tov wishes on her engagement and she didn't respond.
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Riff
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PostPosted: Sun, Jul 22 2012, 10:03 am    Post subject: re: Not invited to wedding - should I send MT wishes?
 
Depends why you want to wish her mazel tov.

If it's because you're truly happy for her.. do it.. and let the honest happiness show...

If it's because you think it's the right thing to do... or (I'm sure it isn't) because you want to 'get her back' for not inviting you, then I wouldn't do it.

Sounds like a difficult situation.

Good luck!
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PostPosted: Sun, Jul 22 2012, 10:03 am    Post subject: re: Not invited to wedding - should I send MT wishes?
 
and if you would know that it's for financial or other significant reason which they cannot share, would that help you?
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PostPosted: Sun, Jul 22 2012, 10:10 am    Post subject: re: Not invited to wedding - should I send MT wishes?
 
Just send her an email wishing her mazel tov.

We don't get to dance at every wedding.
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zaq 3 likes
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PostPosted: Sun, Jul 22 2012, 11:01 am    Post subject: Re: Not invited to wedding - should I send MT wishes?
 
amother wrote:
My first cousin is getting married in a few weeks. She is making a small wedding and didn't invite any family except her and her parents' siblings, AFAIK. A lot of the first cousins are hurt by this,


How juvenile. It would be one thing if she invited some first cousins and not others, or if she invited second cousins and not first cousins--but why be insulted if she invited only siblings? Nobody's being discriminated against.

amother wrote:
especially as in our circles it just isn't done, not to invite close family to your wedding.
and this is a law, yehareg veal yaavor? no wonder the whole wedding business is exploding and getting ever more lavish and cripplingly expensive. because everyone is afraid to do anything differently from what yennem did. I applaud your cousin, actually. she's not afraid to do things her way.


amother wrote:
However, it's her wedding and if she's not interested in sharing the simcha with the family, that's her prerogative.


Please. Lose the 'tude. It's unattractive at best and unjust at worst. You don't know why your cousin is making a small wedding. Why assume she's " not interested in sharing the simcha with the family"? There could be compelling reasons why she's having a tiny affair--and they may have something to do with the chosson's side. For all you know, one of her future ils may be unable to participate in a big bash for some reason. Maybe your cuz is being a good dil, being mevater on her big splash dream wedding for the sake of of her future mil or fil. Either way, she doesn't have to justify her choice to anyone.

amother wrote:
Now, I live pretty far OOT and I wouldn't have been able to come to the wedding anyhow, so I don't really care that I wasn't invited.

You could have fooled me. You sound VERY annoyed. otherwise, why would you be asking the world if you should wish mazal tov to your dear cousin, whom you love so much and are so pained not to have been asked to share in her simcha?

amother wrote:
I would email her mazel tov wishes, but I'm wondering if she wouldn't take this as a snarky comment on not inviting me.


And wouldn't it be? Does a person deserve a mazal tov only from people she invited to her wedding? do you or do you not wish her well?

amother wrote:
FTR, I emailed her mazel tov wishes on her engagement and she didn't respond.


well, that does put a slightly different complexion on it. however, why not try being dlkz, especially during the Nine days? Perhaps your email was accidentally deleted when your cuz was deleteing a long string of spam, or fell through the cracks by some other means. especially in email, messages are easily evaporated or lost. a mistake in one character in the email address can mean that a message is delivered to a total stranger across the globe--one who is not going to reply to you to let you know your message went astray. . Besides--cut a kallah some slack. even with the best intentions, it's not hard to miss one message or forget to respond. No cause to be insulted unless or until you see a pattern.

And even then. .you don't know what's going on with your cousin or her family, and there could be good reasons why she wasn't able to respond.
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PostPosted: Sun, Jul 22 2012, 11:17 am    Post subject: Re: Not invited to wedding - should I send MT wishes?
 
zaq wrote:
amother wrote:
My first cousin is getting married in a few weeks. She is making a small wedding and didn't invite any family except her and her parents' siblings, AFAIK. A lot of the first cousins are hurt by this,


How juvenile. It would be one thing if she invited some first cousins and not others, or if she invited second cousins and not first cousins--but why be insulted if she invited only siblings? Nobody's being discriminated against.

amother wrote:
especially as in our circles it just isn't done, not to invite close family to your wedding.
and this is a law, yehareg veal yaavor? no wonder the whole wedding business is exploding and getting ever more lavish and cripplingly expensive. because everyone is afraid to do anything differently from what yennem did. I applaud your cousin, actually. she's not afraid to do things her way.


Not to be snarky or juvenile, but she isn't saving any money doing it her way. The wedding is going to be in a very swanky, exclusive, not to mention expensive place...

Quote:
amother wrote:
However, it's her wedding and if she's not interested in sharing the simcha with the family, that's her prerogative.


Please. Lose the 'tude. It's unattractive at best and unjust at worst. You don't know why your cousin is making a small wedding. Why assume she's " not interested in sharing the simcha with the family"? There could be compelling reasons why she's having a tiny affair--and they may have something to do with the chosson's side. For all you know, one of her future ils may be unable to participate in a big bash for some reason. Maybe your cuz is being a good dil, being mevater on her big splash dream wedding for the sake of of her future mil or fil. Either way, she doesn't have to justify her choice to anyone.


Can you come up with some reasons to help me be DLKZ? Why would someone not be able to participate in a large wedding but be okay with a smaller one? The only reason I was able to come up with for not being invited was that dc doesn't feel close enough to the family to want to have them at her wedding.

Quote:
amother wrote:
Now, I live pretty far OOT and I wouldn't have been able to come to the wedding anyhow, so I don't really care that I wasn't invited.

You could have fooled me. You sound VERY annoyed. otherwise, why would you be asking the world if you should wish mazal tov to your dear cousin, whom you love so much and are so pained not to have been asked to share in her simcha?

amother wrote:
I would email her mazel tov wishes, but I'm wondering if she wouldn't take this as a snarky comment on not inviting me.


And wouldn't it be? Does a person deserve a mazal tov only from people she invited to her wedding? do you or do you not wish her well?


I wish her very well, believe me. I davened for her for years to find her zivug - she's in her mid-30s - and so did the whole family. We're all overjoyed that she's finally getting married and I really want to acknowledge her simcha. You don't think she would see it as, "Look what a tzaddeikes I am, you didn't feel close enough to invite me but I'm overlooking that writing you anyhow, coals of fire on your head"?

Quote:
amother wrote:
FTR, I emailed her mazel tov wishes on her engagement and she didn't respond.


well, that does put a slightly different complexion on it. however, why not try being dlkz, especially during the Nine days? Perhaps your email was accidentally deleted when your cuz was deleteing a long string of spam, or fell through the cracks by some other means. especially in email, messages are easily evaporated or lost. a mistake in one character in the email address can mean that a message is delivered to a total stranger across the globe--one who is not going to reply to you to let you know your message went astray. . Besides--cut a kallah some slack. even with the best intentions, it's not hard to miss one message or forget to respond. No cause to be insulted unless or until you see a pattern.

And even then. .you don't know what's going on with your cousin or her family, and there could be good reasons why she wasn't able to respond.
[/quote]

That's true, there was something else going on at the time and I would cut her the kallah slack on that one.

So you think I should write her?
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zaq 2 likes
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PostPosted: Sun, Jul 22 2012, 12:49 pm    Post subject: re: Not invited to wedding - should I send MT wishes?
 
YES I think you should write her! What do you gain by cutting her off?

you really don't have much imagination, do you? you can't imagine any reason why a person might not be able to have a big wedding. You can't imagine that a person wouldn't want a big wedding but would be ok with a small one. You think the only reason to exclude cousins is that you don't want them there.

are you for real? how old are you? I hope you're very young because a mature woman should have sufficient life experience to be able to think of reasons, even if those reasons don't resonate with her. But even a young person should also be able to come up with at least one or two good reasons.
Finances are only one reason.

Some people feel that a big splashy wedding is inappropriate for a kallah in her mid-thirties. That's a rather archaic attitude but some people still feel that past age 30 or so it's not becoming.



What do you know about her future inlaws?
--possibly a member of the chosson's family is in avelus and they were told they can't attend a simcha with more than x number of people. Or maybe they just wanted to tone it down out of respect for the avel.
--Maybe one of them is very ill and can't be in large crowds. If someone is on chemo or is immunocompromised for some other reason, they are NOT ALLOWED to be in large crowds. She should exclude the chosson's grandmother or whatever so that you and the other cousins could attend?
-- Maybe her future sil has a phobia of crowds and would go berserk in a group of more than X number of people.
--Maybe her future father-in-law has hearing problems that make it difficult for him to manage in large assemblies.
--maybe the future bil is autistic and is comfortable only with people he already knows.
--maybe the kallah herself hates mob scenes and has decided that at her own wedding, at least, she wants to be comfortable.
--Maybe it's the chosson who objects to mob scenes. She should allow her chosson to be miserable at his own wedding?

point is, there could be any of many good reasons why a woman would have a small wedding, and money is only one of them.

You concede that the kallah had things going on at the time of the engagement. Why are you assuming those issues have been resolved and aren't still ongoing?

Forgive me, but you do NOT sound like someone who esteems or loves her cousin very much. Why are you assuming she'll judge you lechaf chovah if you send her a mazal tov? That doesn't make you sound like a loving cousin. We usually expect the people who love us to assume our motives are pure and expect them to do the same in return. But you are judging your cousin and expecting her to judge you in return. Which you would totally deserve, of course, but why assume she will?

Except for the fact that your cousin is having a wedding limited to immediate family--btw don't forget there's a chosson's side involved here and they just may have had something to do with this decision-- and didn't acknowledge an emailed mazal tov that for all you know she may not have even received--YOU could have made the mistake in one letter in the address--why would she look at you with an evil eye? What are you not telling us?


In any event, this wedding isn't about you. Time for you and the other cousins to grow up. Send the couple a nice card--addressed to both, as they are now an item--and not an email, but a real card via US Postal Service--in which you tell them how happy you are for them both, wish them much nachas, bayit neeman and all that, and send them both your love. Period. Fail to send that card, and you practicaly guarantee a rift in the family. Why should she not say "my rotten cousins, they didn't even bother to wish me mazal tov on my wedding"?
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PostPosted: Sun, Jul 22 2012, 1:40 pm    Post subject: re: Not invited to wedding - should I send MT wishes?
 
Look, you are making this into too big of a production. Write her, wish her mazel tov and all the happiness in the world, and if you can afford it send a nice gift, if you can't stick with the wishes. Ze hu.
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PostPosted: Sun, Jul 22 2012, 3:31 pm    Post subject: re: Not invited to wedding - should I send MT wishes?
 
I think probably she wants to have the wedding SHE wants (and her chassan, of course) Good for her.

Honestly if I would have got married in my mid 30s I would have had a VERY different wedding to the one I did have. I felt my wedding was mostly for my parents.

Obviously she wants a small fancy wedding with the friends and relatives she feels very close to, not a huge basic wedding with a hundred first cousins and aunts and parents colleagues.

Of course it hurts that she doesn't consider you close enough to invite. You don't say what sort of relationship you have apart from being cousins. Are you the same age? are you close otherwise?

I would wish her mazel tov, and try not to let this alienate you.
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PostPosted: Sun, Jul 22 2012, 4:12 pm    Post subject: re: Not invited to wedding - should I send MT wishes?
 
nowadays with all the show-off affairs - how much money can you spend & how many people did they invite - it sounds like a rather practical wedding


send her a gift & be happy for them
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PostPosted: Sun, Jul 22 2012, 4:19 pm    Post subject: Re: re: Not invited to wedding - should I send MT wishes?
 
Raisin wrote:
I think probably she wants to have the wedding SHE wants (and her chassan, of course) Good for her.

Honestly if I would have got married in my mid 30s I would have had a VERY different wedding to the one I did have. I felt my wedding was mostly for my parents.

Obviously she wants a small fancy wedding with the friends and relatives she feels very close to, not a huge basic wedding with a hundred first cousins and aunts and parents colleagues.

Of course it hurts that she doesn't consider you close enough to invite. You don't say what sort of relationship you have apart from being cousins. Are you the same age? are you close otherwise?

I would wish her mazel tov, and try not to let this alienate you.


How close are we? I used to spend many Shabbosim at her house before I was married (we're about ten years apart, but I was also an older single, so she wasn't ten at the time.) I visit her parents every time I'm in town. She stayed at my house for two weeks -and I was very happy to have her - when she vacationed in my city a couple of year ago. We email each other every so often.

Whatever, she certainly can't invite only me and the five other cousins she feels closer to and leave everyone else out. I do understand that.
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PostPosted: Sun, Jul 22 2012, 4:20 pm    Post subject: re: Not invited to wedding - should I send MT wishes?
 
Why are so many people telling me to send a gift? I don't understand. Do you send wedding gifts to people who don't invite you to their wedding?
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PostPosted: Sun, Jul 22 2012, 4:23 pm    Post subject: re: Not invited to wedding - should I send MT wishes?
 
If she wanted to include her extended family, she could make a bigger engagement party or sheva brachos. she didn't.

You extended your wishes already and she didn't respond.

I think you're done.
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PostPosted: Sun, Jul 22 2012, 4:35 pm    Post subject: Re: re: Not invited to wedding - should I send MT wishes?
 
amother wrote:
Why are so many people telling me to send a gift? I don't understand. Do you send wedding gifts to people who don't invite you to their wedding?


You don't need to send a gift (in my opinion).
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PostPosted: Sun, Jul 22 2012, 4:50 pm    Post subject: re: Not invited to wedding - should I send MT wishes?
 
I think its lovely to send MT wishes. No gift necessary. I would send one of my monogrammed correspondence cards vs an email- it seems more heartfelt. Choose your wording carefully so she understands you're sincere.
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PostPosted: Sun, Jul 22 2012, 4:53 pm    Post subject: Re: re: Not invited to wedding - should I send MT wishes?
 
Simple1 wrote:
amother wrote:
Why are so many people telling me to send a gift? I don't understand. Do you send wedding gifts to people who don't invite you to their wedding?


You don't need to send a gift (in my opinion).


I agree NOT to send a gift b/c IMO that ends up looking like you are showing them that you are a much better person than they are. They didn't even bother sending you an invite so NO, I don't think you owe them a gift. I would not give a gift to someone who did not invite me to their wedding but I WOULD send them an email letting them know how happy I am for them. An email doesn't cost any money & shows that you care.
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PostPosted: Sun, Jul 22 2012, 4:59 pm    Post subject: Re: Not invited to wedding - should I send MT wishes?
 
amother wrote:


Not to be snarky or juvenile, but she isn't saving any money doing it her way. The wedding is going to be in a very swanky, exclusive, not to mention expensive place...


Not to be snarky or juvenile, but it's her wedding and her chosson's and they have the right to make their wedding the way they like it. Some people prefer small but exquisite to larger and plainer. This is their prerogative, even if it isn't what you would choose to do. the single largest item in a wedding bill is usually the catering, and many other expenses are also tied to the number of guests. a very luxe but very small wedding almost certainly will cost less than a less lavish big bash. size of orchestra, size of room rented, number of flower centerpieces, amount of liquor are all proportional to the size of the wedding. your cousin's wedding in a very swanky place may very well be coming in at a fraction of the cost of a 400-guest bash in the Bais yaakov of Wherever. for all you know, her family or the chosson's could have an "in" with the owner of the swanky place and be getting a great deal, or have bartered the wedding for some service they are doing.
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PostPosted: Sun, Jul 22 2012, 5:05 pm    Post subject: re: Not invited to wedding - should I send MT wishes?
 
do you send gifts to new babies even if you didn't watch the birth ...

if you said they were making a huge wedding and you're the only one not invited it would be different ... you are a relative & the sincerity of well wishes would come through with a gift ~ remember they're starting off a new life they probably need things [it doesn't have to be elaborate just a token & something useful][if you don't have monies it's a different story ~ then I would simply send a card]
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PostPosted: Sun, Jul 22 2012, 5:12 pm    Post subject: re: Not invited to wedding - should I send MT wishes?
 
I would feel awkward if someone I didn't invite gave me a gift. So it actually might be the right move if the OP wants to take revenge for not being invited Wink

And who watches births besides the husband?
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PostPosted: Sun, Jul 22 2012, 5:21 pm    Post subject: re: Not invited to wedding - should I send MT wishes?
 
Write a nice mazel tov message but don't send a gift, imho.

And I agree with zaq's posts.
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