Zilberman system

Diamond Member Joined: Oct 29 2006 Posts: 4461

I would have to look it up, but I learned that it is actually looked down to learn Torah sh'bktav baal peh.

It must have some basis because when my boys were in Zilberman I asked about this and was told that memorizing is not the intent but bright kids do end up knowing baal peh. They also told me that they thought it was totally unnecessary for a child to understand. All of my children's teachers were trained in the Bet El school.

Posted: Tue, Mar 18 2008, 7:22 pm Post subject: re: Zilberman system

Any comments /comparison re: Bais Hatorah in Lakewood?

Platinum Member Joined: Sep 20 2004 Posts: 17151

Diamond Member Joined: Oct 29 2006 Posts: 4461

The point of R' Zilberman I don't really know, as he was not clear in his talk. In the yishuvim it is very much a way of saying that they are not interested in the non Jewish school model. This has definitely failed in yiras shamayim and knowledge. They also don't want to say that the charedi model is successful. That is an emotional problem.

Before Zilberman the fascination was with the extremely confusing and failed Barkai method, which helped a good many kids take off their kippa totally. Adults who grew up in Barkai who live in our yishuv came to Dan Beeri's speech to testify that in their schools up to 60% of the children turned out non religious. It took that, his admission that he was totally unqualified to produce a method of chinuch and his defense of physical punishment to convince the yishuv that this was not for us.

As in many things there is a need to mitchadesh (big theme here), and at the same time skip what became customary in golus and return to an EY way of doing things. Zilberman makes 3 claims in every sales pitch. Not being like the charedim

1. That this is THE way of the Mishna. Not true from peshat and definitely not true by the meforshim. When I asked the same question as R' Elon, why did not the majority of gadolim set up their chedorim like this I was told that they were wrong, did not understand the Mishna.

2. That this method makes kids so happy. In 1st and 2nd grade maybe. Some of them are happy that they have to make no mental effort. Kids who don't enjoy it: very intelligent kids, those with any kind of attention span issues, those who start it later, those who are curious and those whose home does not make up the lost information. Many of the fans of Zilberman are versed in Tanach and fill in what is missing.

3. That we are going back to the times that every Jew could walk into a shul and read his own aliya. Not only do I doubt this is worth losing all meforshim and starting Gemorrah later than one is ready for it, but this can also be accomplished in 1-2 shiurim a week before BM.

Posted: Wed, Mar 19 2008, 3:41 am Post subject: re: Zilberman system

I wrote about Zichru because I had heard that it was very similar to the Zilberman shitta. Now I see it is nothing like it.

Is the cheder in Lakewood you are talking about based on Zichru or Zilberman?

Platinum Member Joined: Sep 20 2004 Posts: 17151

Diamond Member Joined: Oct 29 2006 Posts: 4461

That is odd because Hilchos TT davka says that today it is not necessary to learn baal peh because printed books have the correct nikud and trop.

Posted: Wed, Nov 25 2009, 7:41 am Post subject: re: Zilberman system

bumping it up

Executive Member Joined: May 23 2005 Posts: 439

*Deleting to just start with the post on a new thread.