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| Arcy |
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 Posted: Thu, Apr 19 2012, 4:46 pm Post subject: Re: re: New Square Shaul Spitzer gets 7 years jail!!!!!!!!!! |
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| DrMom wrote: | | Arcy wrote: | | mazeltov wrote: | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Square_arson_attack
"According to residents of New Square, Spitzer is part of a network of up to 40 men and boys who defend the Grand Rabbi with intimidation and violence."
"On May 5, 2011 the home of another resident, Ari Austerlitz, burned down. The possibility of arson is being investigated in that incident as well"
Aftermath:
"On March 8, 2012 Rottenberg's car was torched"
The above incident happened just last month!! After all this, the violence continues!?
Is all of the above true?!? |
clearly setting sptizer behind bars didn't help.... hashem yishmor. |
First of all Arcy, thx for clarifying your position. I was not the only one who misunderstood your posts, so I'm glad this was cleared up.
I would not say that Spitzer's incarceration "did not help" just because he is not the only (possibly brainwashed) criminal thug operating in NS. I think anyone who does this sort of thing should be jailed, regardless of how many other like-minded (brainwashed?) thugs there are in NS.
And I definitely think NS is a cult. |
of course there should be punishment for those who commit such horrible crimes!!!
I'm not sure I'd use the word cult, but more of a mafia/communist society.... I can repsect the fact that they have certain community mihagim (such as women wearing white aprons and men wearing certain types of boots... ) but when their "minhagim" start hurting other yidden who are not doing anything wrong al pi torah, or hurting other humans period, it's entitheses of jewish and human ethics and Torah values.
I'm very disapointed in other leading "rabbis" and askanim who did not, and are not standing up and saying something against it.... what happend to kol yisroel areiving ze l'ze?
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| IYamWhoIYam |
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| Posted: Thu, Apr 19 2012, 4:51 pm Post subject: Re: re: New Square Shaul Spitzer gets 7 years jail!!!!!!!!!! |
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| Arcy wrote: | | DrMom wrote: | | Arcy wrote: | | mazeltov wrote: | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Square_arson_attack
"According to residents of New Square, Spitzer is part of a network of up to 40 men and boys who defend the Grand Rabbi with intimidation and violence."
"On May 5, 2011 the home of another resident, Ari Austerlitz, burned down. The possibility of arson is being investigated in that incident as well"
Aftermath:
"On March 8, 2012 Rottenberg's car was torched"
The above incident happened just last month!! After all this, the violence continues!?
Is all of the above true?!? |
clearly setting sptizer behind bars didn't help.... hashem yishmor. |
First of all Arcy, thx for clarifying your position. I was not the only one who misunderstood your posts, so I'm glad this was cleared up.
I would not say that Spitzer's incarceration "did not help" just because he is not the only (possibly brainwashed) criminal thug operating in NS. I think anyone who does this sort of thing should be jailed, regardless of how many other like-minded (brainwashed?) thugs there are in NS.
And I definitely think NS is a cult. |
of course there should be punishment for those who commit such horrible crimes!!!
I'm not sure I'd use the word cult, but more of a mafia/communist society.... I can repsect the fact that they have certain community mihagim (such as women wearing white aprons and men wearing certain types of boots... ) but when their "minhagim" start hurting other yidden who are not doing anything wrong al pi torah, or hurting other humans period, it's entitheses of jewish and human ethics and Torah values.
I'm very disapointed in other leading "rabbis" and askanim who did not, and are not standing up and saying something against it.... what happend to kol yisroel areiving ze l'ze? |
You obviously dont know THAT much about the place if you can 'respect' their certain minhagim... They use those 'minhagim' to bully people into doing what they want. I have a friend that used to live there, her husband refused to to wear the boots on shabbos, they were driven so crazy and threatened with all kinds of things that they upped and fled one day. Trust me, no other rabbanim stood up against them because they are just as scared.
And btw, wearing a white apron on friday nights is a typical chassidish minhag, not exclusive to skver. If you walk the streets of Boro Park and Williamsburg on a friday night you'll see the majority of the women wearing a white apron.
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| MommyZ |
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| Posted: Thu, Apr 19 2012, 4:52 pm Post subject: Re: re: New Square Shaul Spitzer gets 7 years jail!!!!!!!!!! |
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| Arcy wrote: | | DrMom wrote: | | Arcy wrote: | | mazeltov wrote: | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Square_arson_attack
"According to residents of New Square, Spitzer is part of a network of up to 40 men and boys who defend the Grand Rabbi with intimidation and violence."
"On May 5, 2011 the home of another resident, Ari Austerlitz, burned down. The possibility of arson is being investigated in that incident as well"
Aftermath:
"On March 8, 2012 Rottenberg's car was torched"
The above incident happened just last month!! After all this, the violence continues!?
Is all of the above true?!? |
clearly setting sptizer behind bars didn't help.... hashem yishmor. |
First of all Arcy, thx for clarifying your position. I was not the only one who misunderstood your posts, so I'm glad this was cleared up.
I would not say that Spitzer's incarceration "did not help" just because he is not the only (possibly brainwashed) criminal thug operating in NS. I think anyone who does this sort of thing should be jailed, regardless of how many other like-minded (brainwashed?) thugs there are in NS.
And I definitely think NS is a cult. |
of course there should be punishment for those who commit such horrible crimes!!!
I'm not sure I'd use the word cult, but more of a mafia/communist society.... I can repsect the fact that they have certain community mihagim (such as women wearing white aprons and men wearing certain types of boots... ) but when their "minhagim" start hurting other yidden who are not doing anything wrong al pi torah, or hurting other humans period, it's entitheses of jewish and human ethics and Torah values.
I'm very disapointed in other leading "rabbis" and askanim who did not, and are not standing up and saying something against it.... what happend to kol yisroel areiving ze l'ze? |
That is an excellent question...
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| Arcy |
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| Posted: Thu, Apr 19 2012, 4:59 pm Post subject: Re: re: New Square Shaul Spitzer gets 7 years jail!!!!!!!!!! |
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| IYamWhoIYam wrote: | | Arcy wrote: | | DrMom wrote: | | Arcy wrote: | | mazeltov wrote: | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Square_arson_attack
"According to residents of New Square, Spitzer is part of a network of up to 40 men and boys who defend the Grand Rabbi with intimidation and violence."
"On May 5, 2011 the home of another resident, Ari Austerlitz, burned down. The possibility of arson is being investigated in that incident as well"
Aftermath:
"On March 8, 2012 Rottenberg's car was torched"
The above incident happened just last month!! After all this, the violence continues!?
Is all of the above true?!? |
clearly setting sptizer behind bars didn't help.... hashem yishmor. |
First of all Arcy, thx for clarifying your position. I was not the only one who misunderstood your posts, so I'm glad this was cleared up.
I would not say that Spitzer's incarceration "did not help" just because he is not the only (possibly brainwashed) criminal thug operating in NS. I think anyone who does this sort of thing should be jailed, regardless of how many other like-minded (brainwashed?) thugs there are in NS.
And I definitely think NS is a cult. |
of course there should be punishment for those who commit such horrible crimes!!!
I'm not sure I'd use the word cult, but more of a mafia/communist society.... I can repsect the fact that they have certain community mihagim (such as women wearing white aprons and men wearing certain types of boots... ) but when their "minhagim" start hurting other yidden who are not doing anything wrong al pi torah, or hurting other humans period, it's entitheses of jewish and human ethics and Torah values.
I'm very disapointed in other leading "rabbis" and askanim who did not, and are not standing up and saying something against it.... what happend to kol yisroel areiving ze l'ze? |
You obviously dont know THAT much about the place if you can 'respect' their certain minhagim... They use those 'minhagim' to bully people into doing what they want. I have a friend that used to live there, her husband refused to to wear the boots on shabbos, they were driven so crazy and threatened with all kinds of things that they upped and fled one day. Trust me, no other rabbanim stood up against them because they are just as scared.
And btw, wearing a white apron on friday nights is a typical chassidish minhag, not exclusive to skver. If you walk the streets of Boro Park and Williamsburg on a friday night you'll see the majority of the women wearing a white apron. |
I think you missed this part of my post: [color=red]but when their "minhagim" start hurting other yidden who are not doing anything wrong al pi torah, or hurting other humans period, it's entitheses of jewish and human ethics and Torah values.[/color]
in theory there is nothing wrong w/ a place having a minhag to wear certain boots or clothes or whatever, but when ppl get violent against those who do not wear or follow a certain minhag,.... well that's just wrong and bad in plain simple launguage....
my problem is not with the boots or whatever, my problem is with how ppl react to those who are slightly different.
it seems like the boots/minhagim became more important then kovod habrios... and that's the root of the evil; misplaced values.
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| Arcy |
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| Posted: Thu, Apr 19 2012, 5:01 pm Post subject: Re: re: New Square Shaul Spitzer gets 7 years jail!!!!!!!!!! |
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| IYamWhoIYam wrote: |
You obviously dont know THAT much about the place if you can 'respect' their certain minhagim... They use those 'minhagim' to bully people into doing what they want. I have a friend that used to live there, her husband refused to to wear the boots on shabbos, they were driven so crazy and threatened with all kinds of things that they upped and fled one day. Trust me, no other rabbanim stood up against them because they are just as scared.
And btw, wearing a white apron on friday nights is a typical chassidish minhag, not exclusive to skver. If you walk the streets of Boro Park and Williamsburg on a friday night you'll see the majority of the women wearing a white apron. |
but that's a problem w/ the people not w/ the minhagim...
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| Tzutzie |
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| Posted: Thu, Apr 19 2012, 5:03 pm Post subject: Re: re: New Square Shaul Spitzer gets 7 years jail!!!!!!!!!! |
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| IYamWhoIYam wrote: |
I have a friend that used to live there, her husband refused to to wear the boots on shabbos, they were driven so crazy and threatened with all kinds of things that they upped and fled one day. Trust me, no other rabbanim stood up against them because they are just as scared.
And btw, wearing a white apron on friday nights is a typical chassidish minhag, not exclusive to skver. If you walk the streets of Boro Park and Williamsburg on a friday night you'll see the majority of the women wearing a white apron. |
I'm not going to comment on the topic of this tread but I just want to add the below.
my cousin lives in NS, her husband DOES NOT wear boots. nor do her kids. also, her husband does not wear their peyos a that curled up way the skvera ppl do. some of her boys do, some don't (she has 18 kids!!!) a few wear it down, a few curled up the skvera way and a few curled around the air. (I know cuz it once came up in a discussion with I had with her).
not saying there is or there is no terror there. just saying about these two things. I hate when ppl take up someone or a group of ppl on things they did wrong and then add stuff that really didn't happen or is not true.
it just bugs me when a person or a group of ppl are categorized as all evil even in the way they are dressed. even if someone (in general) is a murder doesn't mean he is a thief and that he has a bad sense of style!
Just sayin'
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| Arcy |
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| Posted: Thu, Apr 19 2012, 5:09 pm Post subject: Re: re: New Square Shaul Spitzer gets 7 years jail!!!!!!!!!! |
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| Tzutzie wrote: | | IYamWhoIYam wrote: |
I have a friend that used to live there, her husband refused to to wear the boots on shabbos, they were driven so crazy and threatened with all kinds of things that they upped and fled one day. Trust me, no other rabbanim stood up against them because they are just as scared.
And btw, wearing a white apron on friday nights is a typical chassidish minhag, not exclusive to skver. If you walk the streets of Boro Park and Williamsburg on a friday night you'll see the majority of the women wearing a white apron. |
I'm not going to comment on the topic of this tread but I just want to add the below.
my cousin lives in NS, her husband DOES NOT wear boots. nor do her kids. also, her husband does not wear their peyos a that curled up way the skvera ppl do. some of her boys do, some don't (she has 18 kids!!!) a few wear it down, a few curled up the skvera way and a few curled around the air. (I know cuz it once came up in a discussion with I had with her).
not saying there is or there is no terror there. just saying about these two things. I hate when ppl take up someone or a group of ppl on things they did wrong and then add stuff that really didn't happen or is not true.
it just bugs me when a person or a group of ppl are categorized as all evil even in the way they are dressed even if someone (in general) is a murder doesn't mean he is a thief and that he has a bad sense of style!
Just sayin' |
LOL. true. and yes I agree w/ the rest of your post as well...
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| IYamWhoIYam |
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| Posted: Thu, Apr 19 2012, 5:15 pm Post subject: Re: re: New Square Shaul Spitzer gets 7 years jail!!!!!!!!!! |
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| Tzutzie wrote: | | IYamWhoIYam wrote: |
I have a friend that used to live there, her husband refused to to wear the boots on shabbos, they were driven so crazy and threatened with all kinds of things that they upped and fled one day. Trust me, no other rabbanim stood up against them because they are just as scared.
And btw, wearing a white apron on friday nights is a typical chassidish minhag, not exclusive to skver. If you walk the streets of Boro Park and Williamsburg on a friday night you'll see the majority of the women wearing a white apron. |
I'm not going to comment on the topic of this tread but I just want to add the below.
my cousin lives in NS, her husband DOES NOT wear boots. nor do her kids. also, her husband does not wear their peyos a that curled up way the skvera ppl do. some of her boys do, some don't (she has 18 kids!!!) a few wear it down, a few curled up the skvera way and a few curled around the air. (I know cuz it once came up in a discussion with I had with her).
not saying there is or there is no terror there. just saying about these two things. I hate when ppl take up someone or a group of ppl on things they did wrong and then add stuff that really didn't happen or is not true.
it just bugs me when a person or a group of ppl are categorized as all evil even in the way they are dressed. even if someone (in general) is a murder doesn't mean he is a thief and that he has a bad sense of style!
Just sayin' |
Good for your cousin. I did mention before that my husband grew up there, his entire family lives there. I do know the place and the people a tad more intimately than just having cousins there. I was answering to Arcy that I find it difficult to respect a group of people and their minhagim if they use terror tactics against those that dont follow it. Just FYI, they are stricter and crazier about the boots than the payos. I'm not adding stuff that's not true, I hear all this from my in-laws and I'm there often enough to see it for myself.
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| Tzutzie |
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| Posted: Thu, Apr 19 2012, 5:32 pm Post subject: Re: re: New Square Shaul Spitzer gets 7 years jail!!!!!!!!!! |
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| IYamWhoIYam wrote: | | Tzutzie wrote: | | IYamWhoIYam wrote: |
I have a friend that used to live there, her husband refused to to wear the boots on shabbos, they were driven so crazy and threatened with all kinds of things that they upped and fled one day. Trust me, no other rabbanim stood up against them because they are just as scared.
And btw, wearing a white apron on friday nights is a typical chassidish minhag, not exclusive to skver. If you walk the streets of Boro Park and Williamsburg on a friday night you'll see the majority of the women wearing a white apron. |
I'm not going to comment on the topic of this tread but I just want to add the below.
my cousin lives in NS, her husband DOES NOT wear boots. nor do her kids. also, her husband does not wear their peyos a that curled up way the skvera ppl do. some of her boys do, some don't (she has 18 kids!!!) a few wear it down, a few curled up the skvera way and a few curled around the air. (I know cuz it once came up in a discussion with I had with her).
not saying there is or there is no terror there. just saying about these two things. I hate when ppl take up someone or a group of ppl on things they did wrong and then add stuff that really didn't happen or is not true.
it just bugs me when a person or a group of ppl are categorized as all evil even in the way they are dressed. even if someone (in general) is a murder doesn't mean he is a thief and that he has a bad sense of style!
Just sayin' |
Good for your cousin. I did mention before that my husband grew up there, his entire family lives there. I do know the place and the people a tad more intimately than just having cousins there. I was answering to Arcy that I find it difficult to respect a group of people and their minhagim if they use terror tactics against those that dont follow it. Just FYI, they are stricter and crazier about the boots than the payos. I'm not adding stuff that's not true, I hear all this from my in-laws and I'm there often enough to see it for myself. |
as I wrote in my above post, I'm not commenting on the topic of this post. was just stating the facts of how my cousins dress. I was there for shabbos more than once. I SAW them not wearing boots to shul or at all. about the peyos, I did not notice it myself and only my cousin told me later. maybe they had a different experience? donno. and as far as I know, most (please note I said most  )of their married girls do not live in NS. either in monsey or in isreal. they won't let you live there only if both spouses hail from NS originally....
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| sequoia |
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| Posted: Thu, Apr 19 2012, 5:36 pm Post subject: re: New Square Shaul Spitzer gets 7 years jail!!!!!!!!!!! |
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Can someone explain the "boots" thing? What is the significance?
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| IYamWhoIYam |
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| Posted: Thu, Apr 19 2012, 5:41 pm Post subject: Re: re: New Square Shaul Spitzer gets 7 years jail!!!!!!!!!! |
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| sequoia wrote: | | Can someone explain the "boots" thing? What is the significance? |
It's the same shtus like satmer wearing white socks or ger tucking their pants into their socks
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| Faigy86 |
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| Posted: Thu, Apr 19 2012, 5:44 pm Post subject: Re: re: New Square Shaul Spitzer gets 7 years jail!!!!!!!!!! |
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| sequoia wrote: | | Can someone explain the "boots" thing? What is the significance? |
The answer that I got when I asked (maybe there is another answer) is that there isn't any more significance than any of the other aspects of the mode of dress. It is what had been traditional in Skver (maybe because of the mud) and upholding traditions is of the utmost importance in the community.
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| Strawberry2 |
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| Posted: Thu, Apr 19 2012, 6:18 pm Post subject: Re: re: New Square Shaul Spitzer gets 7 years jail!!!!!!!!!! |
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| sequoia wrote: | | Can someone explain the "boots" thing? What is the significance? |
The mishpacha wrote about chassidishe levush in their RH or Succos magazine, if I come accross it again I'll post the reason.
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| celestial |
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| Posted: Thu, Apr 19 2012, 6:24 pm Post subject: Re: re: New Square Shaul Spitzer gets 7 years jail!!!!!!!!!! |
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| Strawberry2 wrote: | | sequoia wrote: | | Can someone explain the "boots" thing? What is the significance? |
The mishpacha wrote about chassidishe levush in their RH or Succos magazine, if I come accross it again I'll post the reason. |
I'm curious about this too!
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| Posted: Thu, Apr 19 2012, 7:01 pm Post subject: Re: re: New Square Shaul Spitzer gets 7 years jail!!!!!!!!!! |
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| Faigy86 wrote: | | sequoia wrote: | | Can someone explain the "boots" thing? What is the significance? |
The answer that I got when I asked (maybe there is another answer) is that there isn't any more significance than any of the other aspects of the mode of dress. It is what had been traditional in Skver (maybe because of the mud) and upholding traditions is of the utmost importance in the community. |
No, it was something along the lines of his father and FIL having different minhagim; one tucking pants into socks, one not or one wearing short pants, so one of the previous Rebbes started wearing boots to cover up what he did regarding pants & socks. Sorry I don't have it exact, but that is the general gist.
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| Bleemee |
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| Posted: Thu, Apr 19 2012, 7:41 pm Post subject: Re: re: New Square Shaul Spitzer gets 7 years jail!!!!!!!!!! |
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| IYamWhoIYam wrote: | | sequoia wrote: | | Can someone explain the "boots" thing? What is the significance? |
It's the same shtus like satmer wearing white socks or ger tucking their pants into their socks | Woah, shtus is a strong word.
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| Posted: Thu, Apr 19 2012, 7:42 pm Post subject: Re: re: New Square Shaul Spitzer gets 7 years jail!!!!!!!!!! |
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| OOTBubby wrote: | | Faigy86 wrote: | | sequoia wrote: | | Can someone explain the "boots" thing? What is the significance? |
The answer that I got when I asked (maybe there is another answer) is that there isn't any more significance than any of the other aspects of the mode of dress. It is what had been traditional in Skver (maybe because of the mud) and upholding traditions is of the utmost importance in the community. |
No, it was something along the lines of his father and FIL having different minhagim; one tucking pants into socks, one not or one wearing short pants, so one of the previous Rebbes started wearing boots to cover up what he did regarding pants & socks. Sorry I don't have it exact, but that is the general gist. |
This is... surreally unrelated to Torah.
Sorry, but "shtus" is the only word that comes to mind.
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| Bleemee |
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| Posted: Thu, Apr 19 2012, 7:48 pm Post subject: Re: re: New Square Shaul Spitzer gets 7 years jail!!!!!!!!!! |
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| sequoia wrote: | | OOTBubby wrote: | | Faigy86 wrote: | | sequoia wrote: | | Can someone explain the "boots" thing? What is the significance? |
The answer that I got when I asked (maybe there is another answer) is that there isn't any more significance than any of the other aspects of the mode of dress. It is what had been traditional in Skver (maybe because of the mud) and upholding traditions is of the utmost importance in the community. |
No, it was something along the lines of his father and FIL having different minhagim; one tucking pants into socks, one not or one wearing short pants, so one of the previous Rebbes started wearing boots to cover up what he did regarding pants & socks. Sorry I don't have it exact, but that is the general gist. |
This is... surreally unrelated to Torah.
Sorry, but "shtus" is the only word that comes to mind. | Many sects of chassidus put on emphasis on traditional dress. And the leaders who did so were Torah leaders. I find your comment disrespectful.
I may not agree on the strength of the emphasis-- ie: making it the ikar when it's not, but that doesn't discount the whole idea. 
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| Posted: Thu, Apr 19 2012, 7:53 pm Post subject: re: New Square Shaul Spitzer gets 7 years jail!!!!!!!!!!! |
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| Yah, well. I'm MO, so maybe MY comment is disrespectful. But IYamWhoIYam is intimately familiar with that world. So I'll take her word on it.
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| Sherri |
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| Posted: Thu, Apr 19 2012, 7:58 pm Post subject: Re: re: New Square Shaul Spitzer gets 7 years jail!!!!!!!!!! |
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| sequoia wrote: | | Yah, well. I'm MO, so maybe MY comment is disrespectful. But IYamWhoIYam is intimately familiar with that world. So I'll take her word on it. | Does that make her comment more respectful?
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