Those $$ Hungry Chevra Kadish members will burn in HELL!!!

Executive Member Joined: Sep 14 2011 Posts: 475

Recently, the Creator took a close family member from us, back to Him. Although it was a sad time for us, the death did not come suddenly. Although we would not admit, many of us saw it coming.

Yet more disturbing then losing a close one, was the behaviors of the Chevra Kaddisha.

First they refused to take the body from the Hospital until Money was given up front. The person in the hospital at the time did not have a check book nor a credit card. They waited HOURS until some1 could come up w/ the payment before even taking the body.

Additionally they would not even bring the body to burial until the rest of the ATRONOMICAL (in the 1000s) fee was fully paid up. (their answer was "if we don't get paid, we don't bring the money it will go back in the firdge" -no exaggeration)

THIS IS CHESED SHEL EMES????? THIS IS A BUSINESS!!! EVERY "CHESED" ORGANIZATION THAT REQUIRES MONEY IN ORDER TO DO THE "CHESED" THEY SPECIALIZE IN IS BUSINESS!!! THEY SELL THEIR "CHESSED" FOR $$$.

I understand every1 need to make a living, but at the expense of a dead person??? that's robbery, at best a business. definitely no chessed there!

Mayb I'm biased but there is NO chesed whatsoever w/ these ppl. EVERY1 gets paid, including the ppl who watch the body and say tehillim.

Additionally, when the family asked for an "itemized bill" asking exactly what all the money was for, the answer was "for all the things that needs to get done... very vague shot answers.

But what choice does the family have? evey1 is pressured because every minute lost is another minute the deceased is left unburied.

I don't know much, but what I do know, is that this is disgusting, and disturbing on soo many levels.

Moderator Joined: Aug 14 2005 Posts: 4555 Location: Ohio

Wow. I am so, so sorry. Our chevra kaddisha does not charge one red cent. They get payment from donations.

(Of course, the funeral home gets money, but that's different.)

Baruch Dayan HaEmes.
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Diamond Member Joined: Mar 29 2005 Posts: 3592

I'm sorry for your loss.

Executive Member Joined: Sep 14 2011 Posts: 475

Executive Member Joined: Jan 13 2011 Posts: 301

Did you ask if there was someone else you could call? And what do they do with people who need to be buried but have no family but still need a Jewish burial? And did you call the local rav?

When my mother died, it cost 13,000 dollars to bury her. Including Chevra Kadisha.

Platinum Member Joined: Feb 20 2009 Posts: 7675

I'm so sorry for your loss.

I have a relative in the CK in Brooklyn, and he is the personification of chesed. I'm sorry your experience was unpleasant.

Platinum Member Joined: Aug 12 2007 Posts: 20504

I'm going to play devil's advocate, though I know there are a lot of CK horror stories:
When you make an event, don't you have to pay something up-front, to ensure that the job gets done? This is another type of event, for which a lot of people don't plan in advance, yet they still want the job done properly. I can imagine how many horrible stories the CK hear - no death is a pleasant time. So they may have instituted this policy a long time ago: cash on the barrel or not work.
They DO need to be paid and I bet this is one of the hardest things to pay for.
KWIM?
המקום ינחם אתכם
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The future simply isn't what it used to be....

I thought the chevra kadisha were voluntary? Dh was a volunteer both in Brooklyn and where we live now. However, there are people to be paid - the plot, the caretaker of the cemetary etc. It could be the money was not going to the CK personal pockets but to pay these expenses.

However, there is no excuse not be nice to a recently bereaved family.

I think like every organization it depends on who you deal with. When we lost a loved one we had the nicest group who helped us every step of the way. My friend who had a stillborn also had a very caring person help her through it. On the other hand I have heard other people say they had bad experiences when they had a stillborn so it really depends on the person.

that being said, after having gone through it myself I will say that there is no excuse to cause added grief to someone who just lost someone they loved. There is always a nice way to do and say something. I'm sorry for your loss and for your horrible experience.
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Diamond Member Joined: Aug 07 2006 Posts: 2556

OP, I am so sorry for your loss. May you be comforted.

I am a little confused. I thought the chevra kadisha was a community/volunteer function. Funeral homes and all the related expenses can really add up, though. IME it is the funeral home that arranged transport from the hospital to the funeral home - and my family's experience in NYC is that yes, they can be "all business," although our complaints weren't about money (brusque, in a hurry, inconsiderate of family, etc). Was it the CK or the funeral home asking for funds? Perhaps in your community the two functions overlap?

Gold Member Joined: Nov 17 2010 Posts: 1018

My deepest sympathies on your loss. May your family be spared further sorrow.

Since I am in my mid-50s, a lot of my friends and co-workers are sadly losing their parents. I hear numerous horror stories about the funeral Crying or Very sad

industry, and the feedback is pretty unanimous that they pressure people for money at a time that they are the most vulnerable. This was also my experience when my mother passed away. Would that I were in a position to come up with $13,000 immediately! At least waiting till after the shloshim would give the mourners a chance to close bank accounts, receive the claim from the insurance company, etc., etc.

It's not the fact that bills must be paid - nobody is disputing this and if ever there was a debt that is a debt of honour, this is one. But somewhere I got the notion that this was a helping profession, and I expected some degree of sympathy, not a shakedown. When the funeral parlour has a monopoly, and there's an urgency to go ahead with the burial, you're up against a wall. Crying or Very sad

Executive Member Joined: Sep 14 2011 Posts: 475

the most disturbing part is that the "head 'rabbi' of the CK" is some1 with whom the meis was close with, the meis was/is many years older than the "head rabbi of the CK", the meis was a huge donor and helped this rabbi on his feet in so many different way, the meis even has a plaque in this "rabbi's" shul/yeshiva/org. (but the meise's family is NOT loaded in the least these days.)

not to mention the meis already bought his burial plot over 20 years ago.

the meis's son and this "rabbi" are close in age and have known for like ever.

it's disgusting and a disgrace to klal yisrael!!! we need moshiach now!!!
in the meantime we need to make a new CK whose members are fully volunteer and whose "head rabbi" is not pocketing extra cash for his own luxurious home and car. this new CK should be supported only by donations and not try to take gov. $$....

every org. that takes gov $$ end usp trying to scam the gov. and any1 they can. it's enough already!!!! stealing from the GOV is a big avla, averia and chilul hashem.

I hope no1 has to die and put themselves at the mercy of the mafia CK of [insert city of choice here]!!!!

Executive Member Joined: Sep 14 2011 Posts: 475

thank you every1 for all your well wishes

I am sorry about your loss and your tzar.

I am totally lost on the government money aspect though. Do chevra kadishas get government money? The people I know of chevra kadishas certainly don't get paid. The mikvah taharah is generally owned and paid for by the funeral home. What is this about?
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Liba, mommy to Zlata Tova 5/6/98, Tziporah Faiga 1/12/01, Esther Rivka 7/13/04 and Avraham Chaim 7/2/2006

Executive Member Joined: Sep 14 2011 Posts: 475

yes the CK does get gov $$. as does Hatzala, & shomrimim, the refua centers/health clinics etc & almost all the local mosdos.... another reason can't figure out how they charge so much.
[LH removed]

Executive Member Joined: Jan 13 2011 Posts: 301

Where I am from, CK gets 500 dollars and thats for the release of the body..but they never pressured us for money before the funeral or the shiva. After shiva when everyone calmed down, they called and said no pressure, but we ask a 500 donation to cover our costs...

The funeral home and rabbi cost money, as well as a plot if you dont have...not to mention the gravediggers have to be paid IN CASH. My mothers plot was 2200, the funeral was 8000, and the rabbi was 2000....and that was the rav of my parents shul where they davened for ten years.

Silver Member Joined: Nov 04 2010 Posts: 897

Yup, burial can be very expensive.
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Executive Member Joined: Sep 14 2011 Posts: 475

Gold Member Joined: Feb 13 2007 Posts: 1266

So I am confused. It sounds like the chevra kadisha in your town functions not just to do taharas, but as a funeral home, so to speak. Is that right? I may be misunderstanding you. But if that's the case, surely you can understand there are fees involved in burial. The way they spoke to you was definitely wrong, but it sounds like they've been unfortunately burned in the past by people who reneged on their obligation to pay. All funeral homes insist on full payment before the levaya simply because once a body is in the ground, the family comes up with all sorts of reasons not to pay. It is standard procedure.

I was saddened by something you said: